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22 May 2009 @ 09:43 am
Mostly they say stuff like, "See you around. Maybe."  
Got some feedback on the Anonymous Writing Meme, and it's so hard not to be discouraged by the negative. One person finds my porn "clinical," which is the kiss of death, and has comments worth considering but seems to dislike my writing enough that I wonder if there's a mismatch in stylistic "goals," so to speak. A few others complain about the shortness of the stories overall, and I can't tell if that's because I've written so many drabbles this year (which some people just don't understand as a writing form, and perhaps they don't notice that the drabbles are always labeled as such), or if in general even my longer pieces are below the desired length threshold. I really wish I were writing longer SPN pieces these days—there have been a few, but not many. Thanks, Season 4, for being the anti-fic. :( I plan to spend some time writing pre-S3 SPN this summer.

Now, not to be cantankerous, but I'm hoping some of you have better intel than me. What happened to the finale of Eleventh Hour? "Harper's Island" started to run in its timeslot, and the regular season is over now. Did the finale air, and just not feel like a finale? Did the show get pulled? Also, what about the remaining episodes of Pushing Daisies? Are they web-available? I don't understand not airing episodes you've already packaged up. It's not as if, in general, I'm watching much on ABC these days. I gave up on Desperate Housewives and Brothers And Sisters. There are too few likable characters on both, and the latter is SO neurotic and soap-opera-like. I don't care for the soap-opera format in general-—it tries my patience. For ABC shows, I'm down to Castle (which I don't really pay attention to—it's just on for Nathan Fillion) and Better Off Ted (which I love, so it's surely marked for death!)

I rode home last night without incident. No flat tire! Though a muscle in my right calf bothered me most of the day, and I didn't sleep that well (same thing last week). I was just in time to shower, rush through dinner, and go to Christopher's Open House. This included a recorder concert that lasted nearly an hour (gah!), and featured about 10 songs. There were about 32 "solo" performances of the limited repertory of songs (6 trips through "Auralee," for instance). It was musical torture. I don't think the recorder teacher understands the balance between displaying what kids have learned and making the audience nuts. :(

From visiting Christopher's future fifth grade class, I see that they'll be reading Where The Red Fern Grows next year. I have very mixed feelings about that book. A cousin gave it to him when he was seven, and we immediately hid it. My aunt gave it to me when I was about 9-10, and while the setting is really vivid, the story disturbed me greatly. I was and am very anti-hunting, and that's the least of the bad that happens in that book. Christopher is fine with the "bloodless" violence of his Star Wars and Lord Of The Rings video games, but I think he's going to have real issues with the book's content. IDK. Times have changed. In my part of the country, hunting wasn't mainstream when I was growing up, and prevailing attitudes toward it have grown even more negative since then. Hunting animals for fur instead of for food? An abomination. I realize the message of the book comes around at the end, but the gory details that cause the character to get there are utterly sickening.

ETA: Surprisingly, no-one has mentioned the subject title yet. I thought surely someone would have recognized it!

she said mysteriously: literary satisfactionresounding_echo on May 22nd, 2009 05:41 pm (UTC)
I don't recall hunting for fur instead of food in that book. Or, at least, don't they hunt for their livelihood? That is, they use the fur? I'm of the opinion that these texts that have content you disapprove of could be seen as an opportunity for discussion, rather than something to be withheld. There are good reasons for you to disapprove of hunting, but alternately there is also a strong argument as to why people hunted in those areas at that specific time. I'm certain the teacher could give Christopher an alternate assignment if you'd rather he not read the text. But in my fifth grade class, I'm fairly certain we read chapters of that book aloud in class.

If I remember correctly, you mentioned once or twice that your children can get deeply upset by sad material, is that so? That book destroyed me when I first read it, but not in a bad way. I think I was mature enough to handle it, or at least could be deeply moved and sad but not so that it upset my daily life. You know your kids best and what they will be able to handle at this stage in their development. At least you have the summer to think about it! :)
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 06:14 pm (UTC)
The main character wants to hunt racoons to sell their pelts.

It's not so much the right/wrong thing, it's the vivid descriptions of the hunting and the eventual awful thing that happens to a human in the book that are so disturbing.

I'm reading "Birdwing" to Christopher at bedtime right now, and some of the descriptions of passing animal destruction are what he considers "TMI"-- and that's after I paraphrase them! They're germaine to the story, and the main character is himself part bird, but they're still... icky.

You definitely remember correctly about the sadness thing, though that's more Lauren than Christopher. Once she gets inside deep sadness, it's hard for her to get out (I share that problem).

That book destroyed me when I first read it, but not in a bad way.
Because of what happened to the secondary human character who was killed, the book made me feel... dirty. Mentally dirty, as if something ugly was in my head that I couldn't ever get out again. Which is a totally different kind of situation than you experience from most books.

I mean, "Charlotte's Web" is heartbreaking, but I don't have doubts about kids reading it. WTRFG is entirely different for me.
(no subject) - resounding_echo on May 23rd, 2009 06:39 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 23rd, 2009 06:53 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - resounding_echo on May 23rd, 2009 07:08 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 23rd, 2009 10:46 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - resounding_echo on May 24th, 2009 06:50 am (UTC) (Expand)
sassy, classy, and a bit smart-assy: SnoopyWoodstockbadboy_fangirl on May 22nd, 2009 06:07 pm (UTC)
Hey Karen. I've been hesitant to do that writing meme just for the reasons you share here. I do think so much is subjective, so it's hard for me to understand if the concrit is well deserved or not (and I tend to really like my own writing, hello narcissist!)

I didn't comment on yours, but I will say now that I haven't read tons of your fic--because of our subjective differences *g* but I have always thought, of the fics I read, that your characterization of Lincoln and Michael were always spot on, which was just another reason not to read the fics I would disagree with because you would probably be able to convince me it was how they would act because your characterization is so good. Does that make sense?

I feel your pain with the recorder concert. I went to my nieces and nephew's Spring Concert a few weeks ago--the band portion was utterly unendurable practically, and when the teacher announced "this next song is Rock in the U.S.A.," I wanted to jump up and correct her. (The correct title for the John Mellencamp song is R.O.C.K in the U.S.A. (he sings the letters, he doesn't say "rock"). Anyway, stupid and insipid and too long was exactly the problem.
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 06:21 pm (UTC)
Does that make sense?
Actually, yes- I can understand your not wanting to be persuaded toward a POV that would upset or 'disturb' you. That totally makes sense to me.

One complaint (from the person who thought the porn was "clinical") was the tendency toward being "flowery" at times (imagine those in the same story, which almost seems like a contradiction). While I definitely don't want to veer off into the "purple prose" territory, if this person thinks (for instance) that Hemmingway is the be-all/end-all of writing, then we have fundamentally different goals. I cannot stand his writing style, and I am equally sure that he would detest mine. Neither side is more valid than the other, they are simply different opinions.

If you love chocolate, for instance, no degree of "fabulousness" in vanilla is likely to ever impress you.

Anyway, stupid and insipid and too long was exactly the problem.
Yes-- I know my parents sat through some pain with our concerts when I was little, however... no-one EVER needs to hear a group performance of "Hot-Cross Buns" or "Merrily We Roll Along" or the two songs that only had two notes (!). Or hear them multiple times.

If you've got 10 minutes of good material, 10 minutes is enough! And if your class can play "Ode To Joy" (and did), then for crying out loud, dump the easy-peasy stuff! :0

One of the biggest misconceptions I run into, as a musician, is that loving music means "you love all music." My M-I-L gave me a piano book of Children's Nursery tunes that she was sure I would love, because I enjoy music. Ha! Every one of those songs is like torture, because they're so simplistic they hurt.

On the other hand, I would have happily sat through the 1/2-hour Kindergarten play that featured groups of kids with their various bug-costume hats (ladybug, praying mantis, butterly, and bee).
dragontattdragontatt on May 22nd, 2009 06:53 pm (UTC)
In the book, I remember more about the dogs than the hunting...or am I confusing it with another book? He gets 2 dogs and in the end at least one dies protecting him from something, right? I'd be more worried my daughter would have a breakdown over the death of the dog than any of the hunting.
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 07:13 pm (UTC)
No, that's the right book. He wants raccoon pelts so he can buy a dog, if I remember correctly.

He loves those dogs, and one of them dies protecting him from the human villain (who gets an axe in the stomach and dies too).

It's all coming back, and I'm getting nauseated just remembering. :(
tyrical: DC_Wonder Woman 1tyrical on May 22nd, 2009 07:18 pm (UTC)
There is a a difference between concrit and style. You may not like a person's style but critically the work is well done. I'm far from an expert but I find you work well written and the p0rn far from clinical.
Then again I'm basing it on the emotional build up from the fic up til that point. As for how others read it I can't speak for. Although style is sooooo subjective. I'm just glad I'm suggestive to yours. :) Hugs...

Note: I've heard good things about Glee it's online on FOX.com so I'm gonna check it out. I thought I'd suggest it.

Edited at 2009-05-22 07:19 pm (UTC)
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 07:59 pm (UTC)
That's always the problem-- concrit vs. style. It's hard to tell whether the comment is meaningful in a larger sense (and people are afraid to tell me, or have moved on already!) or whether it's an issue of style.

I tried out an author a few weeks ago that many people rave about, and I found the writing a little tough to parse (I re-read several paragraphs and sentences because they didn't "gel" the first time), and the overall porn kind of depressing.

Also, I don't typically like "guy" porn for slash, because it's often too emotionally distant and sometimes too "parts in slots" for me to enjoy. I.e., a man lecturing on what slash "should" be like may not have a lot of meaning to me, because slash is primarily written for a female audience.

So, that particular author... I'll probably try again, but my first encounter was underwhelming. And that's likely mostly to do with style!

I'm glad you're suggestive to my style too!

I did see the premier of "Glee," and found it fun, though the music kind of pained me. I don't care for Pop Music much, nor that overly-glossy style of singing.

And a "champion high school glee club" singing ANY song about Rehab is just SO wrong. Can't tell whether that was meant as irony, or whether someone simply didn't notice. :0
JJ: multi-coloured daisyjolietjones on May 22nd, 2009 07:23 pm (UTC)
Hey Karen, I just wanted to say that I tried to leave some feedback on that writing meme thing and it seemed to pop up somewhere quite random. I don't know what I did. Anyway, the gist of it was that (in response to the drabble mentions) I am generally not a drabble fan, but I always always read yours as yours are like long fics condensed down in essence - in other words you say a huge amount with only a few words. I feel sure this is something I've said to you before. I do like your drabbles.

Also, you are a musician?

Hope you and yours are well.
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 08:02 pm (UTC)
I think I saw your comment, and that it DID come in the right area (or one similar to yours!) You'll know if you see a reply from me in your Inbox. Presumably-- either LJ is not mailing MY comments or my service provider is eating them. I can never tell whether that's a general LJ problem or not!

I'm glad you enjoy the drabbles. They're not for everyone, and I never used to enjoy them myself until I encountered people who wrote them well. That made all the difference in the world, seeing examples where the result is a "micro-fic" rather than seeming like a "partial-fic."

I played the violin for years-- majored in music in college for my undergrad degree, and played in a couple of orchestras the three years I lived in Peoria. Plus, I was a classical-music radio announcer for 10 years, so you get lots of exposure there!

As a result, your tolerance for things like "Wee Sing!" and Christmas carols gets very, very low... :0
(no subject) - jolietjones on May 22nd, 2009 08:47 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 08:54 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - jolietjones on May 22nd, 2009 09:09 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 09:17 pm (UTC) (Expand)
PamalaXpamalax on May 22nd, 2009 08:30 pm (UTC)
I always loved Where The Red Fern Grows right from the moment I read it in the 5th grade. None of that stuff bothered me or honestly made an impact but then again I grew in a family originally from the south that often hunted for livelyhood be it food fur or whatever. I actually adore the book to this very day.

As for the feedback it sounds to me, rather than you being clinical, like someone who likes heavily flowery pron. You know *Tight hot cave of passionate love* sort of stuff which thank heavens you do not do. As for the flowery otherwise I'm guessing they like it all, emotion, in the act rather than bothering with it leading up to it.

I'd leave you a comment but I wouldn't have anything much to offer since I think you already know I think you are an exceptionally talented writer who doesnt need tips from the likes of me :o)

Hope you have a wonderful holiday weekend!
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 08:47 pm (UTC)
It's a very good book, but at the same time... it was wrong for me, at least in the time-frame in which I read it. The violence near the end was entirely too much!

You can never guess what someone means with comments like the one I got, but back in the day (hard to believe there ever WAS a day like that) when porn used to embarrass me, I tended to prefer the PG-13 stuff and skim over the more explicit stuff. Which I always figured was me and not the author.

So maybe they want more elliptical porn (in which case, avoiding higher-rated stuff would be best), or maybe they truly find the prose style overly flowery for slash and then hate the porn. I don't know.

Interesting thought about wanting the allusion in the act but not prior to it. I'm sure there ARE readers who look for that!

Hope you have a great weekend too! Ours will possibly be less-than-scorching, which is amazing. We usually get 100+ or downpour, and very little in between. :0
Serena64serena64 on May 22nd, 2009 08:36 pm (UTC)
Please don't be discouraged. I didn't comment anonymously as I usually comment at the time of reading, but I've always enjoyed your stories, especially the drabbles. You've even got me reading slash, which I'm not usually a big fan of, so well done (I think).

Your comment about the open house made me smile. The first music concert they put on at my daughter's school had the same problem - (seemingly) millions of recorder players. Plus out of tune cellos and violins. Two hours of torture!
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 08:51 pm (UTC)
I didn't realize that slash wasn't your thing, so that IS amazing! Good to know!

Your daughter's concert sounds even worse than Christopher's. TWO HOURS?!? Really, an hour would be plenty of any of that, assuming that it was spent on "worthwhile" music (as worthwhile as the young musicians can manage).

My grade-school music teacher might possibly have spent a lot of time verifying the instrument tuning in the practice room before the concerts. Because it takes AGES with strings before kids really get the hang of the pegs and subtleties of "ballpark pitch" vs. "actually the right frequency of pitch." :0
(no subject) - astrothsknot on May 22nd, 2009 10:55 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - serena64 on May 22nd, 2009 11:00 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 11:29 pm (UTC) (Expand)
devon99 on May 22nd, 2009 09:41 pm (UTC)
Don't be discouraged sweetie. As primarily a drabbler myself, I always like to read your drabbles and I always enjoy them. It's harder than people think to streamline your work and pack emotion or story into so few words. You wrote Soft as a Wish a while back for a drabble contest and it still remains a piece that has lodged itself in my mind. Sometimes 100 well chosen words can say so much more than a 1000 words of padding.

You keep drabbling, I will keep reading.
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 11:31 pm (UTC)
I think most people either like drabbles or they don't (though some can be persuaded!). But if a 100-word story doesn't make sense to you, you're going to wonder why the author wastes their time on it (and why isn't it longer! Longer! Longer!)

You certainly know the challenges that come with drabbles, though, and I appreciate your kind words!
Princess Robot Bubblegum!astrothsknot on May 22nd, 2009 10:31 pm (UTC)
that thing with the plastic guy is being shown in full here. you can dl it. if you don't want chris reading the book, see the school

And anonmemes never end well. It's like everyone's all "hey! It's hiatus. Let's wank."

Edited at 2009-05-22 10:48 pm (UTC)
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 11:32 pm (UTC)
Plastic guy, plastic guy... I'm trying to figure out what that is. Doesn't sound like Rufus Sewell OR Lee Pace. :0

It's funny, when I look at things like anonymemes (or any multi-fandom repository) on LJ, it's always such a shock to me that people are so passionate about things like Anime characters and whatnot. Though I'm sure they're thinking the same thing about Supernatural writers and whatnot. :0
The Huntresshuntress69 on May 22nd, 2009 10:50 pm (UTC)
I remember the recorder "concerts" - it was enough to send me to a bar afterwards LOL.
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 11:33 pm (UTC)
Hahaha! God, it was painful. After the first 5 songs followed by soloists, HalfshellHusband flipped over the program that I thought was only the list of performers. That was when I realized that we weren't even 1/4 through the concert.

brigid_tanner: Dean-scratching headbrigid_tanner on May 22nd, 2009 10:56 pm (UTC)
"Clinical" is never a phrase I'd associate with your writing. I didn't think I'd like drabbles till I started reading yours, and realized how much emotion and detail could be packed into just 100 words. Sometimes it's hard to leave feedback though, without quoting the whole story cause it all fits together so well.

I don't like the anonymous things cause I think it makes it too easy to be mean. If I have a problem with something in a story, I'm either going to email the writer directly or just not read them, cause their style doesn't fit me. I'll email if I think I can give constructive criticism and I think the person is open to it. If it just leaves me cold, I'll go away without commenting.

No comment on "Where the Red Fern Grows" cause I don't remember it. The descriptions people have left sound vaguely familiar, but apparently it didn't make much of an impression on me. But I was reading Dracula in the 6th grade, so blood didn't bother me a lot ;)
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 22nd, 2009 11:40 pm (UTC)
"Clinical" porn is one of the worst things ever-- nobody wants to come off that way!

I HAVE had people email me on occasion, with things like "*koff* You gave character X the wrong name"-- and boy do I appreciate that!

But mainly, if people don't fully like what you write then they tend not to comment, so you don't get a feeling for, say, why very few people seem to have read your last porn or whatever.

"Where The Red Fern Grows" stuck in my memory as being fairly graphic in some areas that really disturbed me. I was kind of the sensitive type, so it was really the wrong book for me. It's hard to gauge with Christopher, though most of these things get resolved simply by encountering them slightly later in life. I wasn't expecting this one so soon. :(
(Deleted comment)
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 23rd, 2009 10:40 pm (UTC)
The person who made those comments may very well know what they're saying, but the problem is that without examples of, say, "clinical porn," the feedback is meaningless. Is it that the person doesn't like NC-17 (and shouldn't read it)? Is it that a few stories in particular didn't work for them, though they love porn in general? Examples of the last could be helpful. No examples? Not so much.

The person may be complaining that they find the slash overly flowery, which again... that would be a good point. The writing in general? That's just personal taste.

Nice to see you around here a little more! :)
(Deleted comment)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 25th, 2009 02:25 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - maerhys on May 25th, 2009 03:14 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Deadbeat Nymph: dean bites lipdeadbeat_nymph on May 23rd, 2009 04:39 pm (UTC)
I'm sorry that the feedback meme had such crappy results for you, although I did see some very positive ones, too, and I hope that you won't dwell on the negative ones at the expense of internalising the positive ones.

I did the meme, too, and was pleased enough with the results. I only got three comments, but that's actually more than I was expecting. I did get some concrit, but it was fair, I thought.

I have never read Where the Fern Grows - I went to French school, so I haven't read a lot of books that seemingly everyone else has read - but it sounds like your concerns are valid. I can see how it might be worthwhile reading for an older audience, though. I'm surprised they didn't save it for 7th or 8th grade. =/
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 23rd, 2009 10:53 pm (UTC)
I do tend to dwell on the negative more, mainly because someone knocking the porn that you rarely write is hard to forget! :0

I haven't read enough of your works to get a larger feel except that I would like more porn with no spanking/domination issues, and that while it takes you a long time usually to finish something the results are worth it-- in terms of quality, arc, and theme. Keep at it!

For the book I mentioned, it would be great at an older age, I think. HSH never read it, but his younger brother was very disturbed by it. I'm pretty shocked that the people who DID read it and commented all remembered that the main character's dog died (I'd forgotten), but not that a human being did! That's the part (and description) that really got me, even if he was an unlikable human being. It's very disturbing.

One of the problems you run into with advanced readers (like Christopher's class) is that people forget that there is no accompanying maturity. They're smart, but they're still kids (10-11 in 5th grade next year).

With the schools in general, though, we've struggled with this before. They lack a sense of "age-appropriateness" at times. For instance, I don't want my Kindergartner knowing anything about Martin Luther King day-- not why it was necessary (in their rosy world, that racial ugliness does not exist and never did), and certainly not that he was murdered for his beliefs. I don't want them knowing that ANYONE gets murdered for anything. Abraham Lincoln's assassination gets covered the following month, and again... these are Kindergartners. You can evade until they're in 3rd-4th grade and can handle that information, and then they should know. But not at five. :(
(no subject) - deadbeat_nymph on May 24th, 2009 07:15 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 25th, 2009 02:30 am (UTC) (Expand)
etherealflaim: admirationetherealflaim on May 23rd, 2009 07:15 pm (UTC)
(I'm back! And working on a short sorry-I've-been-gone-for-so-long fic)

I LOVE Where The Red Fern Grows! But yeah, I'm not entirely sure people who don't have my latent ability to compartmentalize feelings (read: my father taught me never to cry) should be reading it in grade school. However, my mother (saint that she is) reads it to her fourth grade class, so I can ask her what a parent who was worried about the book should do =).

I am intrigued by this anonymous writing meme, but I think I should hold off on posting one myself until I've actually gotten back into the writing mode. Hopefully this summer will afford me the luxury of freetime after a grueling semester buried under a quarter ton of schoolwork.

And, because I can hardly contain myself (prison break spoiler: if you aren't caught up yet, don't read on) ZOMG Michael/Lincoln is no longer brothercest! Muahahahaha, I think we knew it all along. I have so many ideas about ways to weave this into fic that I am about to explode ^_^.

Anyway, how have you been doing, my dear?
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 25th, 2009 02:37 am (UTC)
Great to hear from you again! I'd resigned myself to the idea that the Internet connection just didn't work out for you last semester, but then realized that SOME people are done with the school year by now and that we might be hearing from you soon. Voila!

WTRFG is an excellent book, but it's very much a question of at what age for a given child. I really think 4th/5th grade is too young for schools to be covering it. Some children might be okay with it at that age, but I don't think it's most.

Christopher firmly rejected the Lemony Snicket books in 2nd grade (when all the other kids in his class were reading them-- it's an advanced learning program). He was so disturbed by the Baudelaire children having been orphaned, and that continual bad things happened to them, that he could not find the books funny. At the beginning of fourth grade, he tried them again and loved them.

3rd grade, he read an abridged "Huckleberry Finn" and nearly didn't make it past the opening where we discovered that Huck's father was a drunk who treated him badly. :(

Michael/Lincoln will always be brothercest to me! First, because the 4th season does not exist (when your canon becomes entirely crack, that's your fate), and second because they grew up thinking of each other as brothers and that doesn't change. However, for M/L fans in general that's probably a good thing!

Hope you'll be recovered soon from your difficult semester. College used to drain the very life force out of ME, and I while I loved it I also found it exhausting.
(no subject) - etherealflaim on May 25th, 2009 04:21 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 26th, 2009 05:38 pm (UTC) (Expand)
Maerhysmaerhys on May 23rd, 2009 10:07 pm (UTC)
I was positive that meme was going to have me throwing ever project I am working on out the window and it made me realize something, something you say very well:

While I definitely don't want to veer off into the "purple prose" territory, if this person thinks (for instance) that Hemingway is the be-all/end-all of writing, then we have fundamentally different goals.

I got the "overly descriptive, overly poetic" comments, and they are valid. I am, but that's my style. I've written poetry, actively worked as a poet for a decade, and I can't shut that off when I write fiction. I like Hemingway and similar writers a lot but I do not write sparse prose which seems to be prized in the SPN fandom quite a bit. I (and you) can't please everyone. I love your stories and your style, I love that you play attention to language and the flow of words. And your porn is clinical? I literally LOL'd at at that one if only because I can point to some clinical, phoned-in porn within two clicks. Gah.

IDK. The meme was interesting, I got feedback I never expected but I won't be doing one again. Not being I don't want feedback, I do, but I think feedback via the 'net is difficult enough and doing it anonymously just adds to the confusion. Also there is a difference between "you could do this to make XYZ clearer or flow better, etc." versus someone just not liking the work being done and wanting it changed to suite their tastes. /tl;dr
The Coalition For Disturbing Metaphorshalfshellvenus on May 23rd, 2009 10:31 pm (UTC)
I got the "overly descriptive, overly poetic" comments, and they are valid. I am, but that's my style. I've written poetry, actively worked as a poet for a decade, and I can't shut that off when I write fiction. I like Hemingway and similar writers a lot but I do not write sparse prose which seems to be prized in the SPN fandom quite a bit.

That's exactly it for me-- my first writing was in poetry, and I tend to prefer a more descriptive style in reading myself. I personally can't stand Hemingway's style-- it makes me feel as if I'm reading a telegram instead of a novel-- and really, those are just fundamentally different goals. I've read purple prose (in published novels, even), and it slo-o-o-ows me down. But I'm certainly not going to aim for an adjective-free life, either! It's not how I think, and it isn't how I write. Lots of people love the poetry and flow in the language I use, and I think they're just better suited to my style.

And your porn is clinical? I literally LOL'd at at that one if only because I can point to some clinical, phoned-in porn within two clicks. Gah.
I'm always aiming for "hot," and sometimes it's via implication in a PG-13 kind of way. In the very detailed porn, though, I want it to still be clear to the reader what's happening without veering off into, "And then Dean grabbed Sam, twisting in a slow counterclockwise motion while gripping his buttocks and licking his neck."

Also there is a difference between "you could do this to make XYZ clearer or flow better, etc." versus someone just not liking the work being done and wanting it changed to suite their tastes.
That's always the problem-- it's never specific to a certain piece (even if you ASK for examples, which I've done). Even a specific example of what the person considers to be negative would be helpful, because you could consider it in that light and try to read it with different eyes. But no-- just general complaints, which unfortunately don't always help (they might, though!)
(no subject) - deadbeat_nymph on May 24th, 2009 07:17 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 25th, 2009 05:40 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - maerhys on May 25th, 2009 03:06 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 26th, 2009 07:12 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - maerhys on May 26th, 2009 09:52 am (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - halfshellvenus on May 26th, 2009 05:33 pm (UTC) (Expand)
(no subject) - maerhys on May 26th, 2009 08:34 pm (UTC) (Expand)